Datsun Bluebird 910 estate - front struts

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Talking Hoarse
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Datsun Bluebird 910 estate - front struts

#1 Post by Talking Hoarse » Sun Nov 01, 2015 12:03 pm

I only ever seem to post when I need help ......

Treading new ground for me here but I feel sure someone will have done this all before.
I needed /wanted to rejuvenate the front suspension of my 1983 W910 Bluebird (ie 910 estate). However the KYB listed inserts (parts 665014 or 365011) are end of life and no longer obtainable.
Assured that the struts on saloons, coupes and estates were same size (and I seemed to corroborate that with cross reference charts to other manufacturers) I have bought 2 910 saloon inserts - KYB ref 364003. They look the part however when put against the strut they are about 8 cm too long. Picture attached.
The struts (at least the 1st side I have removed) appear not to have cartridge inserts too and so just may be rebuild-able as an alternative? Picture attached of this too.
Help? What should I do?

Ed
Attachments
Inside strut.jpg
Inside strut.jpg (82.92 KiB) Viewed 4565 times
cartridge & strut.jpg
cartridge & strut.jpg (68.11 KiB) Viewed 4565 times

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JPB
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Re: Datsun Bluebird 910 estate - front struts

#2 Post by JPB » Sun Nov 01, 2015 1:09 pm

Ed, I had similar difficulty in finding rear struts for my Corolla and - if I'd believed the "expert" advice in some of the Toyota fora - I'd have been trundling about on later parts intended for an Apex GT by now but fortunately, someone had done the physical research and found a mismatch that precluded that option. I eventually found that Euro Car Parts (no, honestly..) carry the correct parts and at a very fair price. Not bad going for a supplier with the word "Euro" in their name.
Unfortunately, inserts are now becoming harder to find for anything more than a few years beyond its third birthday and some folk are going down the aftermarket coilover route instead (avoid this if you want to preserve the well-damped and characteristically accommodating ride of an older Japanese car), but if ECP can do Nissan as well as Toyota bits, they may be worth asking.
Don't expect to find inserts, do expect their complete struts to come in at around £130 per pair for quality parts to O/E standard, add between £20 and £40 if you need new bump stops and shrouds to go on while you're in about at it.

Another source of hard to find stuff (most things for a 25 year old Toyota are still available here in the UK, but maybe the same isn't so true of a slightly older Datsun?) is yahoo.jp, which works brilliantly once you find a reliable proxy agent.
Australia and New Zealand are also worth scouring for routine parts for older Japanese motors as their kinder climatic conditions mean that many Datsuns, Toyotas, Mazdas and such things are still working and not returning to nature quite so soon as they did here back in the '70s and '80s.
A parcel from Australia gets to the UK typically within six working days and, although sending there costs a fortune, their postal charges are very reasonable for UK buyers.
J
"Home is where you park it", so the saying goes. That may yet come true.. :oops:

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SirTainleyBarking
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Re: Datsun Bluebird 910 estate - front struts

#3 Post by SirTainleyBarking » Sun Nov 01, 2015 4:21 pm

http://www.micksgarage.com/

Based in Ireland, which has been one of the main hubs of the grey import market in Europe, There is a big market over there for parts for Jap parts on vehicles over 5 years old.
That's where I get ignition parts and filters for the wifes 15 year old Mazda 323 BJ. It's a 1.3, and loads were imported for motability (This is an ex motability car - but private sales were primarily the 1.6)

Worth a punt?
Landrovers and Welding go together like Bread and Butter. And in the wet they are about as structurally sound

Biting. It's like kissing except there's a winner

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JPB
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Re: Datsun Bluebird 910 estate - front struts

#4 Post by JPB » Sun Nov 01, 2015 9:54 pm

I just had a very enjoyable (and not all that expensive..) visit to that Mick's Garage site and have now ordered all of the service parts for the Corolla's next visit to the workshop however, sadly, they don't seem to list the front dampers or damper inserts for Ed's Bluebird. It's not all bad news though, Ed, as that site does offer rear dampers for your lovely blue Datsun so is definitely worth a look if those need to be replaced at some time. The prices are very keen.

8-)
J
"Home is where you park it", so the saying goes. That may yet come true.. :oops:

Talking Hoarse
Posts: 79
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2011 5:46 am
Location: Winchcombe, Glos, UK

Re: Datsun Bluebird 910 estate - front struts

#5 Post by Talking Hoarse » Mon Nov 02, 2015 6:08 pm

Many thanks all who have advised. I really value the guidance given.
Further research suggests that the inserts quoted by KYB for my car (ie those correctly for the estate and not the saloon /coupe ones I have) are cross referenced to others by Sachs, Monroe, Boge etc but then so are the (too long) ones I that have also cross referenced to those same units. So I am reluctant to buy more inserts without seeing and measuring! I have confirmed briefly with KYB that the units they list for my car are no longer supplied.

So in order to get the car back onto its wheels and back onto the road (I do want it out for marshalling WRGB in Hafren next week .....) I will clean it all up, put the new strut /tie bar bushes on that I have, swap a track rod end and refill the struts with fresh oil pending finding better inserts for another day.
So now then - my new question....... What is the oil to use? Mr Haynes says "325ml of Nissan genuine strut fluid". I haven't yet posed that one of my local Nissan dealer, but can I presume hydraulic fluid (eg motorbike fork oil?) will do, in which case what viscosity (eg SAE 10 etc)?
Many thanks as ever
Ed

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Re: Datsun Bluebird 910 estate - front struts

#6 Post by History » Tue Nov 03, 2015 9:06 pm

Some Shock dampers are rebuildable even if the maker didnt intend that someone would try to.

Dampers are simple machines that flow oil though small holes.

I have seen schader air con R12 valves brazed to dampers.

Bob

History
Posts: 365
Joined: Tue May 05, 2015 8:03 pm

Re: Datsun Bluebird 910 estate - front struts

#7 Post by History » Thu Nov 05, 2015 8:55 pm

Damper oil.

Various choices ATF. LHM. Tractor hydraulic oil. Diesel fuel

Nothing particularly special about damper oil.

Changing Viscosity is a way of tuning a damper.

I put engine oil in lever arm dampers once, it stopped an A60 wallowing around.

Talking of dampers.

Cars with steering boxes usually have a steering damper inside the idler. These need to be topped up with oil once in a while. Usually ATF. Refer to workshop manual.


Bob.

Talking Hoarse
Posts: 79
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2011 5:46 am
Location: Winchcombe, Glos, UK

Re: Datsun Bluebird 910 estate - front struts

#8 Post by Talking Hoarse » Fri Nov 06, 2015 7:54 am

Thanks again all.

One strut had a lot less fluid to drain out than other and damper action felt jerky before refill. Both struts thankfully were clean and shiny inside and leak free. I have refilled each strut with SAE10 fork oil, and action is now much smoother. Fingers crossed that it is all better than before when I get it back down on the ground.
Next question is to get the (wrong) inserts returned, shame as they were bargain gas pressure KYB's. Then maybe need homework again to find out how to sort the struts next time (?). Seems that the very last of these estates like mine not only had the coil sprung /4 linked rear axle but also had these different front struts that have longer spring /shorter damper housing, probably only produced for about a year and not sold in Australia (where parts are more plentiful as these cars have a following, but all theirs are leaf sprung). Hope is that the struts were begged off a 280Z or the like.
I used to use Nissan4u website for drawings /part numbers but cant access any longer....any ideas?

Ed

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JPB
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Re: Datsun Bluebird 910 estate - front struts

#9 Post by JPB » Fri Nov 06, 2015 8:41 am

Ed, http://nissan4u.com/parts/bluebird/el_9 ... tration_1/ should take you straight to the front strut diagram, it works fine as far as I can tell.

I'm curious about how you refilled the strut insert though?

Here's the diagram from the page above:

Image
J
"Home is where you park it", so the saying goes. That may yet come true.. :oops:

Talking Hoarse
Posts: 79
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2011 5:46 am
Location: Winchcombe, Glos, UK

Re: Datsun Bluebird 910 estate - front struts

#10 Post by Talking Hoarse » Fri Nov 06, 2015 2:08 pm

Thanks as ever John - I haven't been able to access Nissan4u.com for a while, and still cant so I will try another browser (just hangs trying to load, no http or time out error etc).
I believe that the struts on my car do not have inserts at all, just pistons, rods, valves or whatever within the outer case. When the gland cap was unscrewed, and the strut tipped, oil came out, and was pumped out by action of the piston rod. So I refilled little by little with fresh oil, working the piston up & down to draw in the oil (and I hope the air out). There are threads around describing wet struts (that dont accept inserts?) also on 260Z's and on 120Y's. Fingers crossed.
Ed

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