isuzu

Got something to say, but it's not classic related? Here's the place to discuss. Also includes the once ever-so-popular word association thread... (although we've had to start from scratch with it - sorry!)
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GHT
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Re: isuzu

#41 Post by GHT » Sat Feb 11, 2017 8:18 am

JPB wrote:
Fri Feb 10, 2017 8:34 pm
Chris, you're a pro body & paint man so, in your professional view, should a correctly executed and warranted body repair not be judged to be as good as an unrepaired original panel, in which case the car's previous repair shouldn't technically have affected its value?
I did wonder if that might be commented on. Point is, put two identical vehicles side by side, similar mileage, priced within a few quid of one another. Tell all potential customers that car A has been involved in a collision but has been professionally repaired. Car B has never had any sort of collision. All potential customers would go for B. But if car A was 25% cheaper, that would be a different tale.

Chris' answer will be interesting, whilst I didn't pay too close attention in the physics class at school, I do know that once metal has bent it's structure is corrupted and therefore less strong on additional impact.

The main reason I get a report done is to ensure I'm not buying a ringer. They also check outstanding finance, but the thoroughness of the mechanical check is so exhaustive, that some dealers feel wary when you ask if they are ok with an independent engineer's report.

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Grumpy Northener
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Location: Hampshire UK

Re: isuzu

#42 Post by Grumpy Northener » Sat Feb 11, 2017 10:20 am

Chris, you're a pro body & paint man so, in your professional view, should a correctly executed and warranted body repair not be judged to be as good as an unrepaired original panel, in which case the car's previous repair shouldn't technically have affected its value?
Personally and without being smart arsed about it I would like to think that a repair that I have undertaken could not be found by a vehicle inspector in the first place - having said that a vehicle inspector that refers to a 'professional vehicle body jig' has a 'straightening machine' is somewhat unsure of what he is taking about in the first place unless he was putting it into layman terms which could have well been the case. Having said that I fail to see how the term used that the car has been 'extremely well repaired' can be stated if he found evidence of the repair in the first place.
I do know that once metal has bent it's structure is corrupted and therefore less strong on additional impact.
All vehicle body repairers worth there salt today are fully qualified and that is not just to a collage standard either, they will have undertaken specialist accident repair training through facilities such as 'Thatcham Research' (Europe's leading vehicle body repair research & training facility for manufactures, repairers & the motor insurance sector) and based just around the corner from me. Repairers today will also fully warrant the repair undertaken

A vehicle that has been the subject of a proper impact / accident repair will be no weaker in structure than that of a undamaged identical model - equally important is the fact that the repaired vehicle will be NO stronger that the undamaged identical model - this is a critical factor due to the nature of crumple cell / zone & passenger / driver impact protection - vehicles are built to fold / collapse in certain areas and in doing so the collapsed areas absorb the energy from the impact long before it carries through into passenger / driver cell.

Should a vehicle be repaired using less welds than placed by the factory then the seams split early and the forces of impact energy fail to be absorbed or collected hence the impact energy could continue to travel further in to the passenger / driver cell than intended. Equally if a repairer goes 'gun ho' with the spot & seam welding it will also have a far reaching effect than intended upon impact - the repaired area now being over strong and instead of folding / collapsing the impact is now translated / carried into the passenger / driver cell via a structure that is far more rigid than the manufacture intended.

Like every vehicle purchaser I look for unrepaired / repaired damage - if I consider said repair well executed I would not be walking away from the vehicle - but once I had educated the vendor it would be used as leaver to reduce the price.

Now just going back to the over fabrication / over welding of repaired vehicles - I see it more times than enough but not particularly in modern vehicles - but in classics being restored - with owners / repairers often thinking that they are doing better than the factory / manufacture by welding repair areas to excess - the same principle applies - if the area is ever subject to impact the energy forces are going to travel to a greater extent than originally intended - this is a really important point to consider when taking into account the lack of impact / accident protection that is offered in classics when compared to the modern vehicle - that said I would rather see a classic repaired by over welding than the few tacks and thick application of polyester filler or worse still a bung of bridging filler with a smear of filler and some shiny paint to cover it up :o
1937 Jowett 8 - Project - in less pieces than the Jupiter
1943 Jowett Stationary Engine
1952 Jowett Jupiter - In lots of peices http://Jowett.org/
1952 Jowett Javelin - Largely original
1973 Rover P6 V8 - Original / 22,000 miles

rich.
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Re: isuzu

#43 Post by rich. » Sat Feb 11, 2017 1:39 pm

Grumpy Northener wrote:
Thu Feb 09, 2017 9:23 pm
tipper body needs a coat of paint
Rich - Come over to visit the relatives in Blighty and leave the truck with me for 48 hours and you can have it painted FOC :thumbs: (It's a long way to come for a paint job though)

Can't help with Radio 4 though (I would rather pickle my eyeballs than listen to that particular radio channel)
thanks mate! thats very decent of you!
you win this weeks top bloke award :thumbs: :thumbs: :thumbs:

GHT
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Re: isuzu

#44 Post by GHT » Sat Feb 11, 2017 11:24 pm

That's a very informative reply, Chris, and thanks for taking the time to post it. The point about over welding is only obvious when pointed out. A car needs crumple zones if it's to absorb impact, strengthening such zones will have a domino effect, obvious though it is, I never would have thought about it.

The engineer did use the term: "Jig." Adding a straightening device when I frowned. Thinking about what you said of a professional repair, and only speculating, there must be additional evidence, if only to the trained eye, other than the repair to the point of impact. The fact that the dealer never argued with the report tells me he knew.

It was the dealer's reticence that caused me to walk away. If he had explained, as you did, that the repair was to a given standard, and if I was still unhappy, he would gladly source me another car, I would have felt that he was trustworthy. It's all about customer relations in the end.

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Grumpy Northener
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Re: isuzu

#45 Post by Grumpy Northener » Sun Feb 12, 2017 8:23 am

It was the dealer's reticence that caused me to walk away. If he had explained, as you did, that the repair was to a given standard, and if I was still unhappy, he would gladly source me another car, I would have felt that he was trustworthy. It's all about customer relations in the end.
GHT - Given the above I cannot fault you for walking away - I would have done the same - even in todays market and regardless what I am purchasing I still abide by my one chance rule i.e. There is a filling station in the next village - I have filled up there once in 3 years reason being that after putting just shy of £100 quids worth of fuel in a motor I then went to pay for it - service was slow, sloppy and I got for wants of better expression 'grunted' at - no hello or can I help (no goodbye or thanks a lot either) - I simply will not tolerate such attitude (Now you know why I get labelled with the term 'Grumpy Northener') - instead I drive past and travel on to the next one (it's a mile further) but I always get a warm welcome & good service - it just happens to be better stocked too and they always have a smile and a little chat with me when I fill one of the classics up - It is has you state very much 'all about customer relations'
1937 Jowett 8 - Project - in less pieces than the Jupiter
1943 Jowett Stationary Engine
1952 Jowett Jupiter - In lots of peices http://Jowett.org/
1952 Jowett Javelin - Largely original
1973 Rover P6 V8 - Original / 22,000 miles

rich.
Posts: 6804
Joined: Wed Jan 05, 2011 9:18 pm

Re: isuzu

#46 Post by rich. » Thu Mar 16, 2017 7:08 am

GHT wrote:
Fri Jan 13, 2017 3:22 pm
GHT wrote:Stand by for tales of woe.
update, i like my truck it does everything i ask except radio 4.....well, feeling a bit chilly i put the heater on & now the blower motor sounds like a large bolt has dropped in & now needs to come out :(

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JPB
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Re: isuzu

#47 Post by JPB » Thu Mar 16, 2017 8:54 am

:lol:
Keep it running and the foreign body will find its own way out in the end, either through natural physical forces or a massive heater fan explosion.
:scared:
J
"Home is where you park it", so the saying goes. That may yet come true.. :oops:

rich.
Posts: 6804
Joined: Wed Jan 05, 2011 9:18 pm

Re: isuzu

#48 Post by rich. » Thu Mar 16, 2017 8:53 pm

funnily enough thats nearly what happened.. i turned the fan up to 4 (i was cold) then there was a loud bang & now the fan makes a noise on all 4 speeds.. :(

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JPB
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Re: isuzu

#49 Post by JPB » Thu Mar 16, 2017 10:05 pm

Ooh-er! :scared:
Still, look on the bright side, the blower motor could have burst into flames and barbecued you into an early grave. :lol:
J
"Home is where you park it", so the saying goes. That may yet come true.. :oops:

rich.
Posts: 6804
Joined: Wed Jan 05, 2011 9:18 pm

Re: isuzu

#50 Post by rich. » Fri Mar 17, 2017 7:01 am

is getting the fan motor out an easy job?

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