Poor restoration query

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gt67
Posts: 26
Joined: Mon May 30, 2011 2:24 pm

Poor restoration query

#1 Post by gt67 » Sun Sep 11, 2016 1:54 pm

A friend of mine had a Mini Cooper restored last year by a local restorer here in Cornwall. She had to return the car several times to get paint niggles etc sorted.

Now, a year on, the car is starting to show bubbles in the repaired areas. I would have expected the repairs to last a bit longer than this! I know minis can rust a bit but a year seems not long.

Would she have any legal comeback to complain about this?
Thanks for any advice folks.

rich.
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Joined: Wed Jan 05, 2011 9:18 pm

Re: Poor restoration query

#2 Post by rich. » Sun Sep 11, 2016 5:44 pm

have you tried the citizens advice service? was there any guarantee with the works carried out?

GHT
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Joined: Mon Jan 26, 2015 3:09 pm

Re: Poor restoration query

#3 Post by GHT » Sun Sep 11, 2016 11:47 pm

gt67 wrote:Would she have any legal comeback to complain about this?
Thanks for any advice folks.
Yes indeed. There are a number of options, as Rich says, Citizens Advice, but they can't act for you, what they will do is point you in the right direction. The body that can act, and they are draconian, is The Trading Standards Office, you will need to search for your local branch.
There's the name and shame tactic, on social media, and various forums.
If the garage that carried out the work is a member of any association, that body will assess the complaint and act accordingly. And you could always try the press. The Daily Mail, for all it's faults, does a good job of putting right these kind of wrongs.

Believe me, I'm no expert in restorations or repairs, but I do know that if a spray job is done anywhere but a sealed spray booth, all the airborne dust particles, that might seem invisible, get sucked into the jet spray and sooner or later, they surface, causing blisters. Another cause is not properly cleaning and de-greasing the final prepped surface.
I would bet that The Mini Cooper won't be right until it's been stripped and done properly. Bad news I know, but The Trading Standards office will be on your side.

It might be interesting to know exactly how the garage worded their work on the invoice. For example, if they wrote: Strip and completely remove existing paint, prepare bodywork, de-grease, prime and paint. The invoice is itemised, it's easy to prove that they didn't do what they claimed to have done. But if they just put, Restore Mini Cooper, it's very vague. Sorry for the bad news.

Flatlander
Posts: 96
Joined: Mon Apr 06, 2015 10:31 am

Re: Poor restoration query

#4 Post by Flatlander » Mon Sep 12, 2016 2:00 pm

One of the criteria for someone working on cars for a living is that they have the competence to do so.

For as long as I can remember, there has always been a number of cowboys in the motor trade. Sadly, it seems that hese people have been joined by others passing themselves off as "restoration specialists."

I can think of one a while ago that took on a job that he had not the capability of doing and asking how on a forum. Coincidentally, this "expert" (I use the word loosely) was down in the West Country somewhere. In my world, that is akin to a surgeon going out into the corridor and asking the cleaner where he should make the incision....

Many people love their classics, and I admire those that have the courage to admit to themselves they do not have the competence to work on them, and so leave them to someone that can. I do find it deplorable that some see these owners as nothing more than a source of income, and take on jobs that they are not capable of doing. Why can these self proclaimed experts not have the intelligence to say "we cant do the job, as we dont have the facilities to do it!"

A thought strikes me. If it could be proven that this particular expert had actually asked for advice on a forum, and I know of a few that do, then it could possibly be used to strengthen the case for Trading Standards/Citizens Advice/Consumer Protection/Whoever to be able to act.

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Grumpy Northener
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Location: Hampshire UK

Re: Poor restoration query

#5 Post by Grumpy Northener » Tue Sep 13, 2016 6:46 pm

Unless you obtain a full and detailed estimate that states exactly what is getting done for the money then you do not have a leg to stand on - you need to avoid any restoration expert / specialist that states simply to repair & respray - what is the repair process ? is it to cut out any perforated metal, weld in new, make good the panel profile by lead loading, final profiling, preparing priming, painting & polishing along with rust proofing / cavity wax protection to the rear of the repair OR is it knock the tops of the rusted area with a angle grinder - smack the area down with an hammer, load with fibre filler possibly adding newspaper in the large areas to save on material, clag over with some cheap filler, rub down enough to resemble sort of the right shape, chuck a load of polyester spraying filler on it - rub down with da sander when dryish and paint with a shiny 2 pack paint which is possibly thick enough to cover all the minor defects that they cant be ars*d with doing in the first place - don't bother with any protection to the back of the panel either - the repairer is fully aware that he has been vague enough with wording of the estimate & invoice to make sure that anything that comes back will not have any redress.

Needless to say the latter repair process is quick, easy & cheap to undertake whilst the proper process as outlined is difficult, time consuming, with most of the work undertaken by hand and therefore expensive

Always ask others - request references - view other work that has been undertaken before committing to any restoration work - any restorer worth his salt will willingly supply such information.

The classic market is strong and the freeloading bodgers out there are very much aware of the fact - much like dodgy builders they take what they can and return the absolute minimum that they can get away with whilst painting the restoration industry in a very poor light :twisted:
1937 Jowett 8 - Project - in less pieces than the Jupiter
1943 Jowett Stationary Engine
1952 Jowett Jupiter - In lots of peices http://Jowett.org/
1952 Jowett Javelin - Largely original
1973 Rover P6 V8 - Original / 22,000 miles

rich.
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Re: Poor restoration query

#6 Post by rich. » Tue Sep 13, 2016 7:17 pm

any chance of some more detail & pictures please?

vulgalour
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Re: Poor restoration query

#7 Post by vulgalour » Sun Sep 18, 2016 1:00 am

On the subject of experts asking on forums, that's not too unusual. Even an expert can look for advice or confirmation of an issue if it's an unusual one or a problem they simply haven't encountered before, so depending on context I wouldn't be too upset about that unless they are asking about a really basic issue and have said they know the car inside and out to the customer, if you catch my drift.

A respray only lasting a year? Well, that's no good is it. Again, before getting out the Daily Mail (I would never recommend this) and pitchforks, I'd like to know more about what work was done. If rust is coming back through on a car that's been super well cared for, hidden in a nice dry garage and never gone out in the rain after a bare metal as-new restoration with high quality paint job then there's something very wrong. If it was just a blow-over to tidy up a daily driver that lives on the street it's not so surprising.

Context is vital. I've encountered customers go off half-cocked at an issue when they paid lemonade money for champagne work and I've encountered professionals who have charged champagne money for lemonade work. I'm slow to condemn until I know the facts rather than the opinions.

If the work is poor quality and you feel you've been misled then it's likely Citizen's Advice and Small Claims Court. If it's reality and expectations not lining up then it's a case of suck it up and learn from the mistake. Without more clear information, clearer and fairer advice cannot be offered.

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